10:03 a.m.
Context:
Libvirt can already detect the active VFs of an SRIOV PF device
specified in a network definition and automatically assign these VFs to
guests via an <interface> entry referring to that network in the domain
definition. This functionality, however, depends on the system
administrator having activated in advance the desired number of VFs
outside of libvirt (either manually or through system scripts).
It would be more convenient if the VFs activation could also be managed
inside libvirt so that the whole management of the VF pool is done
exclusively by libvirt and in only one place (the network definition)
rather than spread in different components of the system.
Proposal:
We can extend the existing network definition by adding a new tag <vf>
as a child of the tag <pf> in order to allow the user to specify how
many VFs they wish to have activated for the corresponding SRIOV device
when the network is started. That would look like the following:
<network>
<name>sriov-pool</name>
<forward mode='hostdev' managed='yes'>
<pf dev='eth1'>
<vf num='10'/>
</pf>
</forward>
</network>
At xml definition time nothing gets changed on the system, as it is
today. When the network is started with 'virth net-start sriov-pool'
then libvirt will activate the desired number of VFs as specified in the
tag <vf> of the network definition.
The operation might require resetting 'sriov_numvfs' to zero first in
case the number of VFs currently active differs from the desired value.
In order to avoid the situation where the user tries to start the
network when a VF is already assigned to a running guest, the
implementation will have to ensure all existing VFs of the target PF are
not in use, otherwise VFs would be inadvertently hot-unplugged from
guests upon network start. In such cases, trying to start the network
will then result in an error.
Stopping the network with 'virsh net-destroy' will cause all VFs to be
removed. Similarly to when starting the network, the implementation will
also need to verify for running guests in order to prevent inadvertent
hot-unplugging.
Is the functionality proposed above desirable?
--
Thanks and best regards,
Paulo de Rezende Pinatti
3:46 p.m.
On 7/28/20 12:03 PM, Paulo de Rezende Pinatti wrote:
Context:
Libvirt can already detect the active VFs of an SRIOV PF device specified in a network
definition and automatically assign these VFs to guests via an <interface> entry
referring to that network in the domain definition. This functionality, however, depends
on the system administrator having activated in advance the desired number of VFs outside
of libvirt (either manually or through system scripts).
It would be more convenient if the VFs activation could also be managed inside libvirt so
that the whole management of the VF pool is done exclusively by libvirt and in only one
place (the network definition) rather than spread in different components of the system.
Proposal:
We can extend the existing network definition by adding a new tag <vf> as a child
of the tag <pf> in order to allow the user to specify how many VFs they wish to have
activated for the corresponding SRIOV device when the network is started. That would look
like the following:
<network>
<name>sriov-pool</name>
<forward mode='hostdev' managed='yes'>
<pf dev='eth1'>
<vf num='10'/>
</pf>
</forward>
</network>
At xml definition time nothing gets changed on the system, as it is today. When the
network is started with 'virth net-start sriov-pool' then libvirt will activate
the desired number of VFs as specified in the tag <vf> of the network definition.
The operation might require resetting 'sriov_numvfs' to zero first in case the
number of VFs currently active differs from the desired value. In order to avoid the
situation where the user tries to start the network when a VF is already assigned to a
running guest, the implementation will have to ensure all existing VFs of the target PF
are not in use, otherwise VFs would be inadvertently hot-unplugged from guests upon
network start. In such cases, trying to start the network will then result in an error.
I'm not sure about the "echo 0 > sriov_numvfs' part. It works like that
for Mellanox
CX-4 and CX-5 cards but I can't say it works like that for every other SR-IOV card
out
there. Sooner enough, we'll have to handle specific behavior for the cards to create
the VFs. Perhaps Laine can comment on this.
About the whole idea, it kind of changes the design of this network pool. As it is today,
at least from my reading of [1], Libvirt will use any available VF from the pool and
allocate it
to the guest, coping with the existing host VF settings. Using this new option, Libvirt is
now
setting the VFs to a specific number, which might as well be less than the actual
setting,
disrupting the host for no apparent reason.
I would be on board with this idea if:
1 - The attribute is changed to "minimal VFs required for this pool" rather than
"change the host
to match this VF number". This means that we wouldn't tamper with the created VFs
if the host
already has more VFs that specified. In your example up there, setting 10 VFs, what if the
host
has 20 VFs? Why should Libvirt care about taking down 10 VFs that it wouldn't use in
the
first place?
2 - we find a universal way (or as much closer as universal) to handle the creation of
VFs.
3 - we guarantee that the process of VF creation, which will take down all existing VFs
in
case of CX-5 cards with echo 0 > numvfs for example, wouldn't disrupt the host in
any
way.
(1) is an easier sell. Rename the attribute to "vf minimalNum" or something like
that, then
refuse to net-start if the host has less than the set amount of VFs checking
sriov_numvfs.
Start the network if sriov_numvfs >= minimal. This would bring immediate value to the
existing
design, allowing the user to specify the minimal amount of VFs the user intends to
consume from the pool.
(2) and (3) are more complicated. Specially (2).
Thanks,
DHB
[1]
https://wiki.libvirt.org/page/Networking#Assignment_from_a_pool_of_SRIOV_...
Stopping the network with 'virsh net-destroy' will cause all VFs to be removed.
Similarly to when starting the network, the implementation will also need to verify for
running guests in order to prevent inadvertent hot-unplugging.
Is the functionality proposed above desirable?
9:53 p.m.
On 7/28/20 4:46 PM, Daniel Henrique Barboza wrote:
On 7/28/20 12:03 PM, Paulo de Rezende Pinatti wrote:
> Context:
>
> Libvirt can already detect the active VFs of an SRIOV PF device
> specified in a network definition and automatically assign these VFs
> to guests via an <interface> entry referring to that network in the
> domain definition. This functionality, however, depends on the system
> administrator having activated in advance the desired number of VFs
> outside of libvirt (either manually or through system scripts).
>
> It would be more convenient if the VFs activation could also be
> managed inside libvirt so that the whole management of the VF pool is
> done exclusively by libvirt and in only one place (the network
> definition) rather than spread in different components of the system.
>
> Proposal:
>
> We can extend the existing network definition by adding a new tag
> <vf> as a child of the tag <pf> in order to allow the user to specify
> how many VFs they wish to have activated for the corresponding SRIOV
> device when the network is started. That would look like the following:
>
> <network>
> <name>sriov-pool</name>
> <forward mode='hostdev' managed='yes'>
> <pf dev='eth1'>
> <vf num='10'/>
> </pf>
> </forward>
> </network>
>
> At xml definition time nothing gets changed on the system, as it is
> today. When the network is started with 'virth net-start sriov-pool'
> then libvirt will activate the desired number of VFs as specified in
> the tag <vf> of the network definition.
>
> The operation might require resetting 'sriov_numvfs' to zero first in
> case the number of VFs currently active differs from the desired value.
You don't specifically say it here, but any time sriov_numvfs is changed
(and it must be changed by first setting it to 0, then back to the new
number), *all* existing VFs are destroyed, and then recreated. And when
it is recreated, it is a completely new device, and any previous use of
the device will be disrupted/forgotten/whatever - the exact behavior of
any user of any of the previously existing devices is undefined, but it
certainly will no longer work, and will be unrecoverable without
starting over from scratch.
This means that any sort of API that can change sriov_numvfs has the
potential to seriously mess up anything using the VFs, and so must take
extra care to not do anything unless there's no possibility of that
happening. Note that SR-IOV VFs aren't just used for assigning to guests
with vfio. They can also be used for macvtap pass-through mode, and now
for vdpa, and possibly/probably other things.
> In order to avoid the situation where the user tries to start the
> network when a VF is already assigned to a running guest, the
> implementation will have to ensure all existing VFs of the target PF
> are not in use, otherwise VFs would be inadvertently hot-unplugged
> from guests upon network start. In such cases, trying to start the
> network will then result in an error.
I'm not sure about the "echo 0 > sriov_numvfs' part. It works like
that for Mellanox
CX-4 and CX-5 cards but I can't say it works like that for every other
SR-IOV card out
there.
It works that way for every SR-IOV card I've ever seen. If it isn't
written in a standards document somewhere, it is at least a defacto
standard.
Sooner enough, we'll have to handle specific behavior for the
cards to
create
the VFs.
If you're wondering if different cards create their VFs in different
ways - at a lower level that is possibly the case. I know that in the
past (before the sriov_totalvfs / sriov_numvfs sysfs interface existed)
the way to create a certain number of VFs was to add options to the PF
driver options, and the exact options were different for each vendor.
The sysfs interface was at least partly intended to remedy that
discrepancy between drivers.
Perhaps Laine can comment on this.
About the whole idea, it kind of changes the design of this network
pool. As it is today,
at least from my reading of [1], Libvirt will use any available VF
from the pool and allocate it
to the guest, coping with the existing host VF settings. Using this
new option, Libvirt is now
setting the VFs to a specific number, which might as well be less than
the actual setting,
disrupting the host for no apparent reason.
I would be on board with this idea if:
1 - The attribute is changed to "minimal VFs required for this pool"
rather than "change the host
to match this VF number". This means that we wouldn't tamper with the
created VFs if the host
already has more VFs that specified. In your example up there, setting
10 VFs, what if the host
has 20 VFs? Why should Libvirt care about taking down 10 VFs that it
wouldn't use in the
first place?
2 - we find a universal way (or as much closer as universal) to handle
the creation of VFs.
Writing to sriov_numvfs is afaik, the universal interface to create VFs.
3 - we guarantee that the process of VF creation, which will take down
all existing VFs in
case of CX-5 cards with echo 0 > numvfs for example, wouldn't disrupt
the host in any
way.
Definitely this would be a prerequisite to anything.
(1) is an easier sell. Rename the attribute to "vf minimalNum" or
something like that, then
refuse to net-start if the host has less than the set amount of VFs
checking sriov_numvfs.
Start the network if sriov_numvfs >= minimal. This would bring
immediate value to the existing
design, allowing the user to specify the minimal amount of VFs the
user intends to
consume from the pool.
(2) and (3) are more complicated. Specially (2).
A very long time ago this feature was discussed, and we decided that,
since many users of VFs were doing so via <interface type='hostdev'>
directly (managing the pool of VFs themselves rather than using the
libvirt network driver), that if we were going to have the functionality
to create new VF devices, that functionality would be useless to those
"many users" if it was done by the network driver. Instead, we figured
it would be more appropriate to implement it in the node-device driver,
which already has an API to create and destroy devices. This way it
would be of use to all those people using <interface type='hostdev'>
(e.g. all OpenStack users). The only problem is that the node-device
driver at the time had no concept of persistent configuration (which
would enable it to re-create the VFs at each host boot), so it would end
up just being a thin wrapper over "echo 10 >/sys/.../sriov_numvfs" that
would still need to be inserted into a host system startup file
somewhere. Because of that, any implementation of the functionality was
deferred until the node device driver had persistent configuration, and
because the workaround is so trivial (add a single line to a shell
script somewhere), the need for this feature didn't raise the priority
of enhancing the node device driver in order to support it at all.
Thanks,
DHB
[1]
https://wiki.libvirt.org/page/Networking#Assignment_from_a_pool_of_SRIOV_...
>
> Stopping the network with 'virsh net-destroy' will cause all VFs to
> be removed.
That is very dangerous and would need several checks before allowing it.
> Similarly to when starting the network, the implementation will
also
> need to verify for running guests in order to prevent inadvertent
> hot-unplugging.
>
> Is the functionality proposed above desirable?
>
>
In the end, I'd say I'm at best "ambivalent" about doing this. I think
it would be better if we could do it via the node-device driver so that
everyone could take advantage of it. On the other hand I do also
understand that is a much more difficult proposition, and likely to not
get implemented, and that it would be nice if the creation of VFs were
handled "somehow" by libvirt. (BTW, if all users of VFs did so via a
libvirt network, then I would probably 100% agree with your proposed
implementation. From what I've heard, it's been less common than I
envisioned when I implemented it though.)
1577
days inactive
1578
days old
2 comments
3 participants
participants (3)
-
Daniel Henrique Barboza -
Laine Stump -
Paulo de Rezende Pinatti